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    CELTA CELTA CELTA !!! (views: 1429)

    - Online - Mon, 30 Aug 2004 Posted by ykle

    "CELTA or equivalent." How many times have you seen this on a job ad? I'm not talking about jobs in Korea or China, I'm talking about jobs in Europe and sometimes Latin America. What does "equivalant" mean? ....

    Re: CELTA CELTA CELTA !!! (views: 1042)

    Online (Online) - Wed, 01 Sep 2004
    Posted by Metal Image

    well i was told that its basically the same prog, except for toefl, which is higherlevel ....

    TOEFL vs. TESOL (views: 2147)

    Online (Online) - Wed, 01 Sep 2004
    Posted by eigoman

    TOEFL is a test for English students. TESOL is a certificate designation for teachers and the generalized term that describes the teaching we all do, be it ESL or EFL. It is also a membership organization. ....

    TESOL vs. The Telfers (views: 975)

    Online (Online) - Mon, 06 Sep 2004
    Posted by ykle

    Too Enamoured with Selves at home to care about Others teaching English overseas and Looking for support. ....

    Huh? (views: 1091)

    Online (Online) - Thu, 09 Sep 2004
    Posted by tesolguy

    As I understand it, TESOL Inc. in an organization for *ESL* teachers in the United States. TEFL issues are most likely beyond their mandate and of little concern to their membership. ....

    Newbie Primer (views: 978)

    Online (Online) - Wed, 01 Sep 2004
    Posted by TESall.com

    Check out our Newbie Primer page for more on the various acronyms associated with teacher training and everything else TESOL-related: http://www.tesall.com/newbie.html ....

    Re: Newbie Primer (views: 978)

    Online (Online) - Wed, 01 Sep 2004
    Posted by eigoman

    It is amazing to me how few people who work as English teachers actually understand the terms of the trade. And I'm not talking about newbies, either! I don't know how many times I have heard people say things like, "I just got back from seven years of teaching ESL in Japan." Really? When did Japan become an English speaking nation? Some people think it isn't a big deal, but to me it's lazy, even irresponsible. Understanding how ESL and EFL diffe....

    Re: CELTA CELTA CELTA !!! (views: 1236)

    Online (Online) - Tue, 31 Aug 2004
    Posted by tesolguy

    My understanding is that "equivalent" is: 1) That the course be at minimum 100 hours in class; 2) That the course include a minimum of six hours of supervised practise teaching; 3) That the course be externally moderated. ....

    BLAH BLAH BLAH !!! (views: 1346)

    Online (Online) - Mon, 30 Aug 2004
    Posted by eigoman

    Good question! There has been a lot of talk about this (directly and indirectly) on Dave's of late. According to CELTA propenents, the only real "equivalent" is Trinity TESOL because, like CELTA, it is "externally moderated." Interestingly enough, it came out on Dave's that CELTA's moderation isn't all that external afterall. Trainers from other CELTA centres evaluate their fellow trainers. Hmmm.... ....

    Great Guardian Article (views: 1176)

    Online (Online) - Sat, 04 Sep 2004
    Posted by eigoman

    If you haven't read this article yet (it was on the Ticker today), you should: http://education.guardian.co.uk/tefl/story/0,5500,1220371,00.html The CELTA saga continues! ....

    IATQUO and the reality of the situation (views: 2045)

    Online (Online) - Mon, 06 Sep 2004
    Posted by ykle

    The CELTA saga will play on and on until people stop butting heads and start working together. Not that that is likely to happen! I give kudos to TEFL International for backing IATQUO in the creation of a truly independent *and* universal validating body. If some CELTA and Trinity courses would buy in (which they won't), our industry would leap forward significanly with regard to professionalism. ....

    Re: IATQUO and the reality of the situation (views: 1081)

    Online (Online) - Thu, 09 Sep 2004
    Posted by eigoman

    True. It's a "two ends of the same stick" scenario for me, though. If TESOL Inc. (or some other major body) would expand their mandate, a universal accrediting body would become a reality instantaneously. If you ask me, that route is a lot shorter and easier than building something like IATQUO from scratch. ....

    I vote for IATEFL (views: 1150)

    Online (Online) - Mon, 13 Sep 2004
    Posted by tesolguy

    I agree with eigoman. IATEFL, with its focus on teaching English as a Foreign Language, is the most logical choice though, not TESOL Inc. Anyone a member of IATEFL? Has it ever considered doing something about accreditation of courses? ....

    Re: I vote for IATEFL (views: 1284)

    Online (Online) - Fri, 15 Oct 2004
    Posted by eigoman

    IATEFL has so-called institutional members. They're not accredited as I understand the term, but they are somehow affiliated. Interestingly, ITC is one of them and, according to posts made on this board and ESL Cafe as well, allegedly on the verge of bankruptcy and in the process of bilking students out of their deposits. Can IATEFL do something about this? Will it investigate? Can students who have not received refunds appeal to IATEFL to have I....

    IFFY IFFY IFFY (views: 1027)

    Online (Online) - Tue, 31 Aug 2004
    Posted by tesolguy

    Following that logic, it should be sufficient for one McDonald's to be inspected by management from another. No need for an independent and, dare I say, actually "external" health inspector. I have no doubt that CELTA is a great course. I only wish its promoters would focus on the product (teachers) and not the process (smoke and mirrors). ....

    teacher trainer (views: 1147)

    - Online - Fri, 20 Aug 2004 Posted by Birgit

    hi there! I have been teaching English as a foreign language for 3 years and am interested in becoming a teacher trainer. I've been involved in teacher training for the last year but I'd like to know whether I need a qualification for this. I live and work in south africa ....

    The Experience and Ability Factors (views: 1232)

    Online (Online) - Mon, 23 Aug 2004
    Posted by tesolguy

    In my opinion, experience and ability should be considered every bit as much as qualifications when it comes to choosing teacher trainers. Training native speakers to teach is a lot different than teaching non-native speakers to speak. ....

    Re: The Experience and Ability Factors (views: 947)

    Online (Online) - Wed, 25 Aug 2004
    Posted by lurkerdude

    This is an excellent point. I could really care less what pieces of paper a trainer has on his or her wall. What they know is only half the equation. How well they can convey it is much more important and no course or credential will make someone a "trainer" of teachers... IMHO. ....

    Re: teacher trainer (views: 1118)

    Online (Online) - Sun, 22 Aug 2004
    Posted by eigoman

    You don't "need" a particular qualification, though different courses request different credentials. For example, to train on a CELTA course you'll likely need a DELTA plus "x" years of experience. Some independent courses require certification plus a master's degree. Others, particularly short courses, may only require overseas teaching experience and a certificate. The Boland School actually offers a qualification in teacher training but I'm no....

    Re: teacher trainer (views: 1010)

    Online (Online) - Mon, 23 Aug 2004
    Posted by Birgit

    Thanks for yor response. I'd like to know where the Boland school is you mentioned, I live in Cape Town. Birgit ....

    Boland School (views: 1381)

    Online (Online) - Mon, 23 Aug 2004
    Posted by eigoman

    Here is the URL for the Boland School's program: http://www.boland-iettc.com/ For more feedback on requirements for teacher trainers, credential options, etc., I would recommend checking out the Teacher Training Forum on Dave's ESL Cafe: http://eslcafe.com/discussion/dz1/ ....

    Boland School (views: 1071)

    Online (Online) - Mon, 12 Sep 2005
    Posted by susan

    BED & BREAKFAST close to that school------Hi there, I have a nice new suite-room in my apartment for rent: King size bed, wardrobe, lamp, flower, air-condition, shower room (inside the bedroom), wide band internet, and with western breakfast! The room rate is Rmb 140/night for one guest, and Rmb 170 /night for two guests. Travel info (traffic, shopping, sight seeing etc, in English, German, Chinese) and laundry are provided free. Long term rental....

    Online TEFL Courses (views: 1362)

    - Online - Thu, 19 Aug 2004 Posted by tesolguy

    Has anyone taken one? How does it differ from simply reading a book? Are you assigned a tutor with whom you can actually converse? Can you watch video of real teachers really teaching? I know the answers likely vary from course to course, but in general terms I can't help wondering how do these things work. ....

    Re: Online TEFL Courses (views: 1294)

    Online (Online) - Tue, 24 Aug 2004
    Posted by D.

    I have no doubt that there are quality courses out there (University of Saskatchewan, English International, etc.) but they remain "online" or "distance" courses just the same. However they are delivered, the bottom line (for me, anyway) is that it must be lacking in one way or another. Why? Because there is not such thing as an online or distance Bachelor of Education program. Enough said. ....

    Re: Online TEFL Courses (views: 1271)

    Online (Online) - Wed, 25 Aug 2004
    Posted by lurkerdude

    I agree. If distance/online learning worked in TESOL, we would all be out of work. Why pay for teachers to travel to Japan, Brazil, etc. when you can study with a native speaker via the Internet from their home in Armpit, North Dakota? ....

    Drawing lines (views: 1048)

    Online (Online) - Mon, 30 Aug 2004
    Posted by eigoman

    Some things (many things?) can be done by distance, some not. I'm not so sure teacher training specific to ESL/EFL instruction can't. We're not surgeons or even lawyers. For the most part we teach conversational English, a language most of us speak fluently. ....

    Re: Drawing lines (views: 1121)

    Online (Online) - Tue, 31 Aug 2004
    Posted by tesolguy

    Excellent point! Maybe we need to first distinguish what type of teacher we are talking about before we try to determine what type of training they require. Conversational English teachers in large chain schools with set curricula and standardized delivery methodologies aren't necessarily even "teachers," are they? They're more like facilitators. But for teachers - real lesson planning, language imparting educators - is online TEFL training enoug....

    work for a native (views: 1441)

    - Online - Mon, 16 Aug 2004 Posted by dany

    Hello from Poland.we are very much interested in getting in touch with a native speaker who would like to come to Poland and teach here.We are a private school in Cracow, big beautiful city in the south of the country.Time of all the applications finishes at the end of September.We need a teacher starting from October.if you're interested contact: theanka@tlen.pl Thank You! ....

    Please post job openings on the Worldwide Job Board (views: 1170)

    - Online - Sun, 15 Aug 2004 Posted by TESall.com

    This board is for discussions only. Please post job openings here: http://www.tesall.com/jobboard/index.pl Thank you. ....

    Teach English and Travel in Beautiful Korea-Paid Teaching Opportunities- (views: 1427)

    - Online - Fri, 13 Aug 2004 Posted by EFLJOB.Com

    Hello. Greetings from Korea! EFLJOB.Com is a recruitment agency that hires EFL(English as a Foreign Language) full time instructors to teach conversational English in Korea. We're currently seeking qualified instructors for openings starting in September/October in Korea. Compensation and Benefits *$1,700-2,000 USD of monthly salary *Visa Sponsorship *Roundtrip Airfare *Medical Insurance *Rent-free fully Furnished Housing *Paid Vacation *Finishin....

    Re: Teach English and Travel in Beautiful Korea-Paid Teaching Opportunities- (views: 1216)

    Online (Online) - Thu, 19 Aug 2004
    Posted by tesolguy

    Some questions to ask when considering a job posted by a recruiter: 1) How soon will I have to start teaching after I arrive? 2) Can I see pictures of the apartment I'll be living in? 3) How close to the school is my apartment? 4) What is the breakdown of contact hours to preparation time in the total number of hours quoted in the job offer? 5) Have you, as the recruiter, been to this school yourself? Have you interviewed the teachers, talked to ....

    insane (views: 1661)

    - Online - Wed, 11 Aug 2004 Posted by Metal Image

    the guy thats in china who wants to hire me has totally screwed me up.. hes given me about 10 days to get all my stuff together.. my visas, my tickets (with no money) and everything.. what am i supposed to do? ....

    Re: insane (views: 1241)

    Online (Online) - Wed, 11 Aug 2004
    Posted by tesolguy

    Schools often need teachers quickly for quite legitimate reasons. Don't be rushed into anything, though, if you haven't completely done your homework on the school, the city, etc. You need to be sure that this is the job you want in a place you will enjoy living. If you aren't ready practically and psychologically, and if you're feeling rushed, still worrying about homesickness, etc. you likely won't be getting off on the right foot. That said, t....

    Re: Done (views: 1266)

    Online (Online) - Thu, 12 Aug 2004
    Posted by Metal Image

    I had to tell the guy in china that i couldnt come cause he wanted me to shell ut a lot of money like to the tune of 1250 just to get over there with no money to live on for a whole month and then he might reemburse me at the end of the monte.. i told him to wait till next semester cause i cant do that... imgonna have to try something else. and the guy from equador hasnt even sent me a slaary and wants me there like tomorrow! what the hell! ....

    its so close (views: 1294)

    - Online - Tue, 10 Aug 2004 Posted by Metal Image

    i got a PHONE CALL! the guy called me just like a few hours ago.. he wants to know if i've made my final desicion.. i told him that i have to get my fare together for the haf i have to pay (im only going six months and i only get half the airfare) ....

    Culture Shock -- Expectation/Realizations (views: 1560)

    - Online - Fri, 06 Aug 2004 Posted by Eddie

    My name is Eddie Mills and I'm the Director of the International Education Exchange Association, Inc. (IEEA -- www.ieea-china.org). My family and I really enjoy our life in China and we wish to help Hainan through education and poverty relief efforts. We have had the honor of dining with the Vice-premier of China, the various officials from the Ministry of Foreign Affairs in Beijing and Hainan Province as well as other officials from various prov....

    Re: Culture Shock -- Expectation/Realizations (views: 1313)

    Online (Online) - Mon, 09 Aug 2004
    Posted by Chris

    Hi there, As a 'soon-to-be-teacher' travelling to teach for the first time I read your post with interest . I have to say that your recommendations and insight make very good sense, I also read the post on the provided link about culture shock and ways to counteract it's effects. My question is this: Are there any good links to teaching position postings in Hainan? I would love to apply for some positions in this apparently beautiful location but....

    Try a search (views: 1139)

    Online (Online) - Mon, 09 Aug 2004
    Posted by tesolguy

    Did you try using the search box at the top of the page. I only got two results for "hainan" when I tried it, but the results are updated often (daily?). Good luck! ....

    Re: Culture Shock -- Expectation/Realizations (views: 1437)

    Online (Online) - Sat, 07 Aug 2004
    Posted by eigoman

    Many of those tips are good advice for any country, Eddie. Nicely said. For me, one of the most important things you brought up was the difference between being a tourist and being a teacher. A lot of teachers don't get that. ....

    lil worried (views: 1274)

    - Online - Thu, 05 Aug 2004 Posted by Metal Image

    i might have a real shot at a job finally.. One that sounds promising in china.. but im a little bit scared at the prospect of going that far away from my family.. any one got any advice? ....

    Re: lil worried (views: 1253)

    Online (Online) - Sat, 07 Aug 2004
    Posted by eigoman

    Good for you, Metal Image. Don't worry too much about being homesick. Getting a job offer now usually means leaving in the fall and getting homesick just in time for winter. You'll likely be somewhere warm or at the very least mild by comparison. Knowing you're missing a blizzard or a cold snap is a great cure for homesickness! ....

    Par for the course (views: 1536)

    Online (Online) - Fri, 06 Aug 2004
    Posted by tesolguy

    First off, congratulations! I hope you get the job and its a good one. Have you done all your research? As for homesickness, it's completely normal. Most teachers experience it, usually within the grander scheme of culture shock. The fact that you are aware you are probably going to miss your family is a good thing. My advice? There is not sure-fire technique, but the following suggestions may help: 1) Make friends with other teachers. They becom....

    need female teacher, who can help us? (views: 1314)

    - Online - Wed, 04 Aug 2004 Posted by steele

    hi, we are a primary goverment school from Luoyan, Henan province in China, which is famous for the 9 dynasty history, Dragon Status, Chinese gongfu, the first temple of China, all kinds of sepecially foods and hospitalities people. more detals please check the Http://www.hnly.com > > now i give you the school's introduction, if you are interesting, please give me your requirements, so the school will try to meet you! please send mail to steele51....

    Anyone heared of this guy? (views: 1363)

    - Online - Tue, 03 Aug 2004 Posted by Cautious

    I'm in communication with a Beijing recruiter and I'm slightly dubious as to his bona fides. Does anyone know of "marc george" or "marc dowel" he advertises in Thats Shanghai magazine and his company name is Beijing Orient Symbol co I declined his offer to come to Beijing and then sign a contract. I'd be an idiot to fly around the world on an email promise. It's a seeming lack of established and logical procedure that I find worrying. The job? He....

    Re: Anyone heared of this guy? (views: 1299)

    Online (Online) - Wed, 04 Aug 2004
    Posted by tesolguy

    As much as I like this site, I would highly recommend posting this question on the China (Job-related) forum of Dave's ESL Cafe: http://www.eslcafe.com/forums/job/viewforum.php?f=9&sid=58a6e61e3da0ae0ad5da964f140f321f There are more and more posters here, but I haven't heard from many (any?) with significant China experience. The guy sounds a bit iffy to me, but it could be inexperience as much as anything else. Still, do you want to be the teach....

    Re: Anyone heared of this guy? (views: 1303)

    Online (Online) - Wed, 04 Aug 2004
    Posted by Cautious

    Many thanks TESOLGUY. I'll heed your advice. ....

    Re: Anyone heared of this guy? (views: 1074)

    Online (Online) - Fri, 06 Aug 2004
    Posted by tesolguy

    Keep us posted, Cautious. Good luck! ....

    is footprints recruiting reputable? (views: 10397)

    - Online - Fri, 30 Jul 2004 Posted by Linds

    Hi, I've been doing more research and came across footprints recruiting. I've been trying to find some people who have worked for them. Anyone know anything about them - whether they're good or bad? ....

    STAY AWAY FROM FOOTPRINTS AND THE EPIK PROGRAM! (views: 4311)

    Online (Online) - Fri, 13 Jun 2008
    Posted by Marc Morgenstern

    Footprints IS NOT reliable, and it is my considered opinion that their recruiting practices are shady, as well as illegal. I am a 45-year old owner of an independent consulting firm based in New York City, with over 15 years of exoerience in ESL instruction, including the NEw York City public schools and premier private ESL language schools in NYC, including Zoni Language Group. Consulting jobs had been scarce this year, and I had considered teac....

    Re: If you think that post was good - check this out! (views: 1399)

    Online (Online) - Sun, 22 Jun 2008
    Posted by touché

    The gentleman that posted above also posted the exact same post on Dave's ESL Cafe and proceeded to get slaughtered for it - so much so that he deleted most of his original posts. Seriously - this is great stuff - http://forums.eslcafe.com/korea/viewtopic.php?t=125730&highlight=footprints ....

    Re: is footprints recruiting reputable? (views: 1293)

    Online (Online) - Tue, 05 Feb 2008
    Posted by CrazyK24

    My experience with Footprints wasn't very good at all. I was constantly being ignored when I sent emails and voicemails to ask what were important questions to me. When my interview time was messed up, I called, and the woman working there was very snarky with me. I eventually had to decide not to go with them, and I wouldn't recommend them to anyone. ....

    re: Footprints recruiting reputable? (views: 1476)

    Online (Online) - Fri, 31 Oct 2008
    Posted by MG

    Similar experience, initial registration with Footprints resulted in delays in email responses, messed up telephone interview times and the FP rep being snarky on the phone. When I was sent e-mails with the list of available jobs the FP rep merely put me in contact with the school directly and that was the end of the FP involvement, particularly the South Korean reps (who were not Korean by the way). Using my own initiative I found my own contrac....

    Re: is footprints/Longbridge recruiting reputable? (views: 1235)

    Online (Online) - Tue, 18 Sep 2007
    Posted by Moe

    I wanted to know from former teachers or anyone knew from a friend of a friend if Longbridge Pacific recruiting services are reliable and reputable? ....

    Re: is footprints recruiting reputable? (views: 2626)

    Online (Online) - Mon, 27 Feb 2006
    Posted by Brian

    Footprints is a great recruiter. Before teaching overseas I dutifully looked on all the message boards and tried to get as much information as positive and in the process told myself that I didn't want to become jaded like so many of those that are on these boards. Funny thing is I have way more time on my hands and feel it's important to get accurate information out to those that are looking for specific answers to their questions to make inform....

    Re: is footprints recruiting reputable? (views: 1303)

    Online (Online) - Sun, 22 Apr 2007
    Posted by Alina

    I have had a good experience with Footprints Recruiting. Their responses are always immediate and helpful. It is nice to have a Western party on your side when dealing with foreign schools, particulary with the Chinese. All of the problems I have had have been with the school here in China, mostly a result of cultural differences, and even then it is not as bad as some of the stories I've heard. Teachers at my school are the highest paid of the f....

    The not-likely-to-be-final word on Footprints (views: 1234)

    Online (Online) - Sun, 08 Jul 2007
    Posted by GoTeacher

    I think the bottom line with Footprints has to be that, on the whole, they are pretty good at what they do and most teachers are pretty happy with the service they receive. ....

    This has been informative... (views: 1219)

    Online (Online) - Mon, 30 Jul 2007
    Posted by Nic

    I'm in the process of doing post-offer research on Footprints and the education in Daegu, Korea, where I will go if I accept. I started this research before getting an offer and now, after reading this forum, I am just as unsure of a decision as before. Seems like ANY entity will make some people happy and leave others dissatisfied. I do agree however, that trying to go to a country to find a job can lead you in circles since most employers want ....

    Re: is footprints recruiting reputable? (views: 1279)

    Online (Online) - Tue, 28 Feb 2006
    Posted by Raoul Duke

    I'm sincerely very glad you had a good experience with a recruiter. This brings the number of credible (I assume you don't work for the Footprints organization) such posts I've read about ANY recruiter up to a number I can still count on one hand...after about 5 years of reading posts. I still stick to my long-term advice: avoid using a recruiter. Decent jobs in decent places usually don't need them and usually neither do diligent teachers. Do th....

    Re: is footprints recruiting reputable? (views: 1311)

    Online (Online) - Sun, 15 Apr 2007
    Posted by Mark Johnston

    Raoul, You sir, are a fool. I am sorry, I have been reading these boards for a long time and you simply give bad advice again and again. Good jobs do NOT stand on their own. They do not appear like a beacon of shining light. Not only that but schools that are in financial difficulty frequently do not use recruiters just for that reason. They post there own jobs, therefore making the school postings just as much a mine field as you make the recrui....

    Re: is footprints recruiting reputable? (views: 1163)

    Online (Online) - Tue, 10 Jan 2006
    Posted by James Sherwood

    My friend and I found our teaching positions in China through Footprints Recruiting and it has been a disaster ever since the beginning. They misrepresented the school we were headed to, claiming it was close to Shanghai. We arrived here to discover our school is out in the middle of nowhere. We contacted Footprints to see if they could move us to another location and they were of no help whatsoever. We figured that since they got us in this posi....

    Re: is footprints recruiting reputable? (views: 1130)

    Online (Online) - Wed, 22 Jun 2005
    Posted by Former teacher

    Reputable? Yes. Helpful? No. Once you're placed, they're not much use. They'll answer questions to sell the job to you, but you can forget about ever getting detailed information on the job or the country. They're more interested in the commission than in telling you the truth. And if you're not happy with your job placement (read: pig in a poke), their only concern is their legal concern, not you. They don't consider problems to be their problem....

    The hand that feeds them (views: 1110)

    Online (Online) - Wed, 22 Jun 2005
    Posted by eigoman

    Reputable but not reliable. I think your post speaks to the grander scheme problem with the recruiting industry as it currently operates. Schools pay, teachers don't. I see teachers posting almost daily advising other teachers never to pay for a recruiters services. That is all well and good as far as things go currently, but teachers seem quick to forget that after they are placed. Not that I don't hear what you are saying, Former Teacher. I do.....

    Re: The hand that feeds them (views: 1052)

    Online (Online) - Thu, 23 Jun 2005
    Posted by Raoul Duke

    Actually, I for one go a step further. I advise not using recruiters _period_, no matter who pays. Using a school-paid recruiter may be even worse... in such a case the recruiter definitely isn't working for _you_. I still maintain that good schools with good jobs don't need recruiters. It's the schools that are badly run and/or offering substandard pay and treatment and/or are located in true hellholes that must turn to recruiters to fill their ....

    Re: The hand that feeds them (views: 1057)

    Online (Online) - Thu, 23 Jun 2005
    Posted by tesolguy

    Re: "I still maintain that good schools with good jobs don't need recruiters." and "The TEFL internet overrunneth with horror stories about recruiters." I agree with both these statements, Raoul. I'm not sure, however, that recruiters per se are the problem but rather *recruiting* as it exists. When you consider the vast distances, language barriers and occupational hurdles involved with teaching English overseas, someone acting in an agent capac....

    Re: The hand that feeds them (views: 1082)

    Online (Online) - Sat, 25 Jun 2005
    Posted by Raoul Duke

    I agree with you...theoretically. If the recruiters ever really worked _on behalf of_ those rookie teachers I'd be all for 'em. If using an agent truly improved one's chances of getting a positive work experience, I'd be all for 'em. Just doesn't jibe with reality. I've read of precious few (approaching zero) credible good encounters with recruiting agents. Even allowing for the fact that people are more likely to go to extra trouble to complain ....

    Re: The hand that feeds them (views: 917)

    Online (Online) - Sat, 25 Jun 2005
    Posted by tesolguy

    "I agree with you...theoretically." And I agree with you...realistically. The recruitment and employment culture of the EFL industry is fundamentally flawed. Teachers in the know advise new teachers to never pay for a recruiter--and that's good advice! But it shouldn't be. Can you imagine professional athletes using agents paid for by their teams? ....

    Re: The hand that feeds them (views: 988)

    Online (Online) - Sun, 26 Jun 2005
    Posted by Raoul Duke

    Yup. A little help navigating these shark-infested waters would be most welcome...especially for the newbies. Unfortunately it just isn't there...at least not from the recruiters. And yeah...it should be. ....

    The hands we feed (views: 1031)

    Online (Online) - Tue, 28 Jun 2005
    Posted by tesolguy

    What do you think of the industry's various membership organizations, Raoul? In my opinion, this is another example of something meaningful they could do. As it stands, most of them seem to do little more than send out journals and newsletters, host conferences and offer professional development opportunities to invidual teachers. How about offering to help devleop the profession itself for all teachers? Membership organizations owe ESL/EFL teach....

    Re: The hands we feed (views: 1004)

    Online (Online) - Tue, 28 Jun 2005
    Posted by Raoul Duke

    'Guy, I'm with you...I've found these associations to be pretty much ineffectual wanking societies. No teeth and no impact. I don't think these would ever have much effect on the realities of English schools in places like China or Korea. However, there is some potential there for education...and education is what could ultimately make some difference. IMHO the only organization that currently has anything close to the real reach needed to make a....

    The Asian EFL Journal initiative (views: 1040)

    Online (Online) - Tue, 28 Jun 2005
    Posted by TESall.com

    We recently posted a Ticker link to a Guardian article on the possible formation of an EFL teacher's union following the Asian EFL Journal conference in Pusan. ....

    Re: The Asian EFL Journal initiative (views: 1138)

    Online (Online) - Thu, 07 Jul 2005
    Posted by Yikes

    Oh, no, please no unions...PLEASE! The Guardian??? That bastion of left-wing propaganda???!!! YIKES! There is a reason why unions are on a serious decline in the world, and even non-existent in some industries...Try managing a union throughout multiple countries, cultures and agendas...Not happening. ....

    Re: The Asian EFL Journal initiative (views: 1019)

    Online (Online) - Sat, 23 Jul 2005
    Posted by eigoman

    I don't know much about the global state of trade unions -- organized labour as many of us understand it (strikes, picket lines, etc.) may well be in decline. Professionalization, however, is not. Associations with varying mandates exist for many labour segments. They do for TEFL as well. The problem is, those that do don't do much. Another thread on this site seems to imply that IATEFL may be on the verge of change that. One can only hope! ....

    Comment on previous posting (views: 1063)

    Online (Online) - Mon, 25 Jul 2005
    Posted by Peter

    It is possible that the previous post refers to a posting I made about IATEFL. I would like to clarify that IATEFL currently has no plans to become an accrediting body and it was not my intention to imply this in anyway. IATEFL is open to discussion of new roles and ways forward. If the industry at large felt there would be an advantage of IATEFL moving into a field already crowded with specialists, then I am sure these ideas would be welcomed an....

    Re: Comment on previous posting (views: 989)

    Online (Online) - Tue, 26 Jul 2005
    Posted by eigoman

    "If the industry at large felt there would be an advantage of IATEFL moving into a field..." Unfortunately, the "industry at large" is dominated by CELTA and Trinity and neither institution has any desire to see the creation of a universal accrediting body. Sorry if I misinterpreted your previous posting. ....

    Re: Comment on previous posting (views: 1029)

    Online (Online) - Wed, 27 Jul 2005
    Posted by Peter

    By the the "industry at large" I had meant the likes of you and I eigoman, and all the other teachers or would-be-teachers who might potentially benefit from such body I agree that TCL and UCLES are without doubt quietly content with the way things currently stand... but how would we, as teachers/middle management/senior management, benefit from such a body and what would we, as teachers/middle management/senior management, want from it? Whilst m....

    Re: Comment on previous posting (views: 942)

    Online (Online) - Wed, 03 Aug 2005
    Posted by tesolguy

    When you speak of "good reason" and "justifiable explanation" I think of professionalism and the very raison d'etre for most of these organizations. Their mandates suggest we are a profession and that they are its standard bearers but the industry reality is anything but professional and its membership organizations status-quo bearers at best. ....

    The end of certificate branding as a substitute for accreditation (views: 959)

    Online (Online) - Wed, 03 Aug 2005
    Posted by eigoman

    "Whilst many people on this and other forums shout loudly the need for such an accrediting body, it is hard to find good reason for this or a justifiable explanation of what the benefits might be..." I touched on this point in another thread on this forum: http://www.tesall.com/international/index.pl?read=1618 We need look no further than the public school systems in our various home countries to find the most important benefit as far as I am con....

    Re: The end of certificate branding as a substitut (views: 1190)

    Online (Online) - Thu, 04 Aug 2005
    Posted by BD

    It'll never happen. The TEFL, TESOL, CELTA, etc, is a for profit enterprise. ....

    Crunch time at Cambridge? (views: 964)

    Online (Online) - Fri, 05 Aug 2005
    Posted by eigoman

    You're probably right, at least from without. But from within I wonder if Cambridge is capable of rationalizing its own inconsistencies. I don't think they have ever been taken to task for offer one standard of training (through its Faculty of Education) for domestic teachers and another (through UCLES) for overseas English teachers. Why doesn't Cambridge's Faculty of Education offer a PGCE in TEFL? Other UK universities are starting to. When pus....

    Re: is footprints recruiting reputable? (views: 1292)

    Online (Online) - Fri, 24 Sep 2004
    Posted by Corinne

    i just wanted to post a message in case the person who emailed me in response to my posting about footprints sees this. i have accidentally deleted the email and as such cannot reply! so if this is you, feel free to email again. i'd be happy to give more info... ....

    Re: is footprints recruiting reputable? (views: 1122)

    Online (Online) - Fri, 10 Sep 2004
    Posted by missmo

    I have worked with them, and they have been exceptional. Like many people, I did my researh before committing, and they have proved to be knowledgeable and respectful. They won't lead you astray and keep in contact with you the whole time. ....

    Re: is footprints recruiting reputable? (views: 1313)

    Online (Online) - Fri, 10 Aug 2007
    Posted by mastertae

    Hi I was wondering if anyone knows about this company. I saw them on monster: gooddaykorea ....

    Re: is footprints recruiting reputable? (views: 1138)

    Online (Online) - Sat, 31 Jul 2004
    Posted by eigoman

    I haven't dealt with them, so I can't comment personally. In terms of general advice, I would suggest checking out EFL-Law.com for a list of things to consider when choosing a recruiter: http://www.efl-law.com/recruit_law.html ....

    Re: is footprints recruiting reputable? (views: 3476)

    Online (Online) - Mon, 02 Aug 2004
    Posted by tesolguy

    You can also check the Veracity Review at Hogwan.com: http://www.hogwan.com/veracity/recruiters.php ....

    My bad experience with footprints (views: 2056)

    Online (Online) - Fri, 16 Dec 2005
    Posted by Jessica

    I am sure the woman who originally posted the question has long gone on her adventures around the world. Hopefully she found a satisfying job. My fiance and I found a job in Japan through footprints. It was awful, we had problems with our company in Japan from the beginning. I believe that footprint knew very little about the company they were placing us with in Japan. Apparently (although not confirmed) they do most of their business elsewhere w....

    Good Experience With Footprints (views: 1611)

    Online (Online) - Mon, 24 Sep 2007
    Posted by JA

    I have read a few of the negative responses posted about Footprints and I can sympathize, but I don't agree. I found Footprints online by mistake when I was looking to see about teaching overseas. I exhausted them with questions and did a lot of research. I even turned down 3 contracts before finally agreeing on one. I think it's about research and talking to other people who have done it. I discovered that I had to look for contracts that stated....

    Re: Good Experience With Footprints (views: 1256)

    Online (Online) - Sun, 11 Nov 2007
    Posted by Don

    You don't need a B'ed to work in a public school in Korea. Any bachelors degree will do. Hours are usually 9-5 M-F. The schedule is easier but there is usually only one foreign teacher in any school. Your responsible for developing your own lessons and curriculum for summer / winter camps so some kind of tefl / celta training is defeinitely helpful. You will experience many last minute changes to class length, days off, and generally being out of....

    Re: Good Experience With Footprints (views: 1277)

    Online (Online) - Thu, 27 Sep 2007
    Posted by Susan

    JA: what other questions did you ask Footprints? And to work in the public schools one needs a B'Ed right? Can I just ask you: what kind of questions were you asked during the interview stage? Thanks ....

    another bad experience with footprints recruiting (views: 1678)

    Online (Online) - Sat, 07 Jan 2006
    Posted by LZ

    I wouldn't count on them. As some of the other posters said, they're working to get their commissions and care very little about the teachers. I started looking at jobs in China with them and it was one empty promise after another. Job descriptions changed, jobs that they promised me later required additional interviews and obstacles. Initially I felt like I had found a really great company to help me find a job in a field where I was very unfami....

    Nice (views: 1126)

    Online (Online) - Mon, 09 Jan 2006
    Posted by Rheno747

    Congrats on getting the job you like. Yeap, flying to a country you're interested in and hitting the pavement (and pressing palms) is the best (maybe ONLY) way to find the job you really want in TEFL. The plane ticket may be something you'll have to eat, but it's good insurance. ....

    All together now:....... (views: 1321)

    Online (Online) - Sat, 17 Dec 2005
    Posted by Rheno747

    All together now in one great shout: Don't sign a contract until you arrive at your new school and check it out. ....

    Re: is footprints recruiting reputable? (views: 1439)

    Online (Online) - Thu, 26 Aug 2004
    Posted by cestal

    I've heard they are indeed reputable. My TESOL instructor recommended them, and i have a friend who is headed over to korea next week after dealing with them... ....

    Re: is footprints recruiting reputable? (views: 1197)

    Online (Online) - Wed, 13 Oct 2004
    Posted by tesolguy

    How did things go for your friend? ....

    FOOTPRINTS hiring criteria illegal (views: 1310)

    Online (Online) - Thu, 28 Dec 2006
    Posted by Skybird

    Footprints restricts their jobs to degree holders only even though the country or posting may not require a degree. A job MUST be available to ALL applicants legally eligible to work when they have the skills that job. That is the law. ....

    Re: FOOTPRINTS hiring criteria illegal (views: 1160)

    Online (Online) - Mon, 24 Sep 2007
    Posted by JA

    You must remember however, that it depends on the country. Since Footprints hires many teachers to work in Asia and the culture bases a lot of weight on education, then it is fitting that the qualified candidate needs to hold at least a Bachelor's degree. Notwithstanding, to teach in either the US or Canada, a candidate must hold a Bachelor's degree and in many cases, a Master's so why should the requirements be any different for jobs overseas? ....

    Re: FOOTPRINTS hiring criteria illegal (views: 1772)

    Online (Online) - Sat, 29 Sep 2007
    Posted by eigoman

    As Footprints gets bigger and bigger, it seems to be more and more of a target. You can't please everyone all the time. As far as this thread goes, there are two opinions I would like to leave readers with: 1) that Footprints does not have an illegal hiring criteria; 2) that Footprints from everything I have heard a pretty good company to deal with. ....

    I recommend Korea Connections over Footprints (views: 1653)

    Online (Online) - Sun, 06 Apr 2008
    Posted by Heather

    I understand that there are only a number of selected recruiters each year for the Seoul Metropolitan Office of Education. Footsprints is one of them. But I recommend Korea Connections(www.koreaconnections.net) who is also one of the selected recruiters for Seoul Public Schools. One person takes care of you from beginning to arrival and does their best to get answers to questions. ....

    Footprints FALSE ads (views: 1305)

    Online (Online) - Sat, 14 Jun 2008
    Posted by Jane

    Footprints now seems to be hiring with no degree for Korea which is only possible for the Korean second generations. So it doesn't make sense for an add to be places as if you could go to Korea wihtout a degree. Especially after a few postings that stress that they hire per law. ....

    Re: Footprints FALSE ads (views: 1227)

    Online (Online) - Sun, 22 Jun 2008
    Posted by john

    Hey Jane - you might want to check out the following link to the Korean Ministry of Education website for the TaLK program - http://talk.mest.go.kr/ A program for people with only 2 years of postsecondary education completed (either a comleted diploma or Associates degree OR 2 year of their Bachelors degree) to teach in rural public schools in Korea. ....

    Re: FOOTPRINTS hiring criteria illegal (views: 1236)

    Online (Online) - Wed, 03 Jan 2007
    Posted by eigoman

    Where exactly is that the law? Every Canadian in Canada is legally eligible to work but that doesn't mean that the University of Toronto can't require a Ph.D for faculty positions. Just because a Bachelor's degree isn't a requirement for a visa doesn't mean a school or recruiter is breaking the law by requiring one for a teaching position. ....

    Re: is footprints recruiting reputable? (views: 1033)

    Online (Online) - Fri, 05 Nov 2004
    Posted by Linds

    Which friend are we referring to? Cause the friend that I know that is going to South Korea, she is going with Footprints. I am also going with them, but to Taiwan. I leave next month :-) ....

    Checklist (views: 1394)

    Online (Online) - Mon, 02 Aug 2004
    Posted by D.

    Questions to ask: 1) Has the recruiter been to the school? 2) Has the recruiter seen the apartment? 3) Has the recruiter successfully placed teachers there in the past? 4) Can you have their email addresses? Things to do: 1) Search for the school and the recruiter at Dave's ESL Cafe, both the Job Information Journal and the Job Discussion Forum. 2) Check with the Better Business Bureau to make sure there aren't unresolved complaints against the r....

    To someone who lost his money. (views: 1357)

    - Online - Fri, 30 Jul 2004 Posted by jhay

    To someone who lost his money. If you have any money you couldn't still get paid or you were promised to receive but couldn't from work(Hagwon) while you were teaching in Korea or until the time you left Korea, you can have the chance to get the money back. Accidentally, I found some disappointing complaints on the internet which was about malicious late payment or non-payment by Hagwon owner. Some people worked hard to be taken a couple month's ....

    Re: To someone who lost his money. (views: 1258)

    Online (Online) - Mon, 02 Aug 2004
    Posted by tesolguy

    This sounds a lot like those lotteries that ask you to put down a deposit before you collect your money. ....

    Re: To someone who lost his money. (views: 1392)

    Online (Online) - Fri, 30 Jul 2004
    Posted by eigoman

    Sounds good, maybe too good (to be true?). How do you help teachers retrieve their money? Do you charge a fee? No offense. You may well be trying to a very noble thing. If that is the case, good for you and all the best. My advice? If you have a legal problem in Korea, start with http://www.efl-law.com ....

    Guidelines - Please read before posting (views: 1490)

    - Online - Wed, 30 Jun 2004 Posted by TESall.com

    [UPDATED JANUARY 26, 2005] TESall.com encourages users to post and reply to postings in the International Job Discussion Forum. To ensure the user experience is as inclusive and beneficial as possible, the following guidelines must be followed: 1) NO JOB POSTINGS! Please post job vacancies here. 2) NO SPAMMING! If you would like to generate traffic for your website, please submit it to our links page. 3) NO TROLLING! There is nothing wrong with a....

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